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NORN KJOKL • View topic - Lord's Prayer in Orkney Nynorn

NORN KJOKL

The Orkney & Shetland Norn Forum
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:33 pm 
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MOD EDIT: I moved this post into a separate thread in the Orkney Nynorn section. Please avoid discussing Nynorn in the subforums devoted to the real Norn. The original post on the Lord's Prayer in Orkney Norn by Ljun is quoted below.
Ljun wrote:
The best preserved text of Orkney Norn is the 'Lords Prayer', we made an effort to 'translate it' into Orkney Nynorn in the old forum.

The translation is based on Hnolt's analyses of the text: http://nornlanguage.x10.mx/index.php?ork_txt

N.B, 'tumtation', 'delivra' and 'on'(and) are of course Scots/English.


Orkney Norn 1700:

Favor i ir i chimrie,

Helleur ir i nam thite,

gilla cosdum thite cumma,

veya thine mota vara gort

o yurn sinna gort i chimrie,

ga vus da on da dalight brow vora

Firgive vus sinna vora

sin vee Firgive sindara mutha vus,

lyv vus ye i tumtation,

min delivera vus fro olt ilt, Amen.

or On sa meteth vera.



We had come this far towards Orkney Nynorn 2010:

Faðir vår ið ir i hjimerige,

Hellegt virði namn þitt,

Goð lað kongsdum(i) þitt kuma,

vilji þin måtti vara gort

å jørðin sin han er gort i hjimerige,

gav vus dag on dag daglight brouð vårt

fyrgive vus syndir våra

sin vi fyrgiva syndara muþi vus,

laið vus ai(gje) i tumtation,

min delivera vus frå ålt ilt, Amen.

or Og så måtti* það veri. (*confusion wether to use the ending -i or -e


N.B. We need the (preferably ORKNEY) norn words for 'tumtation' and 'delivera' so if you find any, pls add them here


English 1662:
Our Father, which art in heaven,

hallowed be thy name;

thy kingdom come;

thy will be done,

in earth as it is in heaven.

Give us this day our daily bread.

And forgive us our trespasses,

as we forgive them that trespass against us.

And lead us not into temptation;

but deliver us from evil.

[For thine is the kingdom,

the power, and the glory,

for ever and ever.]

Amen.
I think we should change the dative, singular ending from e to i

If we look at it:

(in) laaginy
chimrie
Brya-grunyie
asee
Hoosavelji

All of this example expept the last shows -i
and none of them shows e

(This is just my impression of course)

about tumtation we got:
faroese: freistingar
icelandic: freistni
old norse: freistni
danish: fristelse
swedish: frestelse
nynorsk: freisting
bokmål: fristelse

Now we just have to make up a norn word for it ^^
I know all these example is uneeded, but i was curious :b

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Hrafnsmærki skal væifa í vindinum á ný aftr, Þat sum es in sanna Danibrók!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 1:29 am 
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It'll be feminine for sure. Since it's feminine in Faroese and Nynorsk. Unsure about Icelandic and Old Norse though, since those can just aswell be neuter. (compare Faroese erni pride)

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Ungur nemur, gamal fremur.
Gløgt er gestsins eyga.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:44 pm 
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Location: Paris
Do we really need to create pure Scandinavian words for these words? I mean, Norn was a Scandinavian language, but in so rich and hectic a linguistic landscape as the British Isles', where so many languages mixed and influenced each other, can't we just accept some loanwords? Why not just modify their orthography for it to fit Norn phonetic system?

How about deliv(e)ra and tumtasjon?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:55 pm 
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I agree that it's best to use the word 'temptation' ("temptasjon"), as it comes from a real Norn text.
And of course it should be a feminine word like in Faroese and Nynorsk.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:21 pm 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:21 pm 
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Sure, I've never said it didn't, but as you said, the meaning was altered, and tumtation seems to have replaced it. I don't think we should modify the only surviving text in Orkney norn we have just because it's not Scandinavian enough... don't you think?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2013 12:49 am 
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Location: Funningur, Faroe Islands
A question: Would you use regular first syllable stress (TEMPtation) or use foreign stress in loan words (tempTAtion)? And would you also respell the words?

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Ungur nemur, gamal fremur.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 5:08 pm 
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 1:40 pm 
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Actually, we don't have stress in French! I'd go for temptatiOn too though.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 12:15 am 
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Bear in mind though, that both Icelandic (and likely Old Norse) have firm stress on the first syllable, even in loan words. so... :)

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